Jason Hartman hosts Dr. Jane Orient to the Holistic Survival Show. Dr. Orient authored a book entitled, “Your Doctor Is Not In.” He is an Executive Director for the Association of American Physicians and Surgeons. The two have a discussion on Ebola and its threat to animals. They look at radiation concerns in the sea and what to eat to prevent radiation poisoning. Jane recommends getting a Sirad card to measure radiation levels. They give thoughts on climate change, World War 3, and threats.
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Jason Hartman 1:13
It’s my pleasure to welcome Dr. Jane orient to the show. She is executive director of the Association of American physicians and surgeons, president of doctors for disaster preparedness, managing editor of the Journal of American physicians and surgeons, and editor of civil defense perspectives. Author of your doctor is not in healthy skepticism about national healthcare and author of the new book the truth about Ebola protect yourself and your family. Jane, welcome. How are you doing? Fine, how about you? Fine, thank you and give our listeners a sense of geography by telling us where you’re located. I’m in Tucson, Arizona. Oh, not far from me. I’m in Phoenix.
Dr. Jane Orient 1:54
Good, good stuff. Well, maybe first talk a little bit about Ebola. What a scary threat. That is have we seen the worst of that scare in the US? Or should we be prepared for something more? Well, it appears to have died down at the present time in the US. It is by no means over in Africa, which means that if it’s still going on somewhere in the world, we could have imported cases. Public Health is still screening people who travel here by air from the countries that are affected, and they may be kept under surveillance for about 21 days. So does that mean they’ll be quarantine? Actually, no, they’re generally not quarantine, they have different categories of risk. Most of them are not at very high risk. And so they check in by telephone. If they’re not having any symptoms, and they wouldn’t, weren’t really exposed to, to patients who were ill, then that’s probably always needed. But some of them do have face to face surveillance if they feel that it’s a higher risk, and the hospitals are all prepared and for getting personal protective gear and phone numbers of people to call So, so that if they have a patient with with suspicious exposures, they can be taken to a facility that’s better equipped to handle them. Sure, sure.
Jason Hartman 3:09
How are we doing on the possibility of a cure or vaccine? Where are we on that?
Dr. Jane Orient 3:14
Well, there’s some vaccines that are being tested.
Dr. Jane Orient 3:17
But who knows how long that will take? And I’m not sure that one wants to be the first one to take the vaccine, it would seem that the first order of business is to contain the disease. What’s the
Jason Hartman 3:31
status of it in Africa? I mean, you said it’s by no means over. And, you know, certainly it’s not as much in the news as it was for a while there. I mean, what, what’s going to happen? What’s the prognosis for for Africa?
Dr. Jane Orient 3:43
Well, regular reports are not not being sent out any longer, but it lives in, in the animals there. There is an animal reservoir. So it can’t really be totally wiped out, but it’s hoped that it will go away. And at least get down to a level where you there may be an isolated case here and there. But it’s not being widely transmitted. It may reemerge at some some other point and was carried by bats and other animals in the wild, many of which are hunted for food by people. And then there’s, there’s the danger, the burial practices there that heavily expose families to deceased loved ones who are infected. Before we move on to some other things that I want to cover. What else would you like people to know about the Ebola threat? Just anything that I haven’t asked? I think that we need to be a little more concerned about importing disease from from abroad. It used to be that that visitors, or at least people who were planning to stay here for a period of time, had a much more intensive screening they have now right now, it’s much more difficult to get an animal into the country than it is to get a human being even though that human being may be carrying some diseases that will already familiar with here a den gay and chicken glia are a special threats and we are seeing those their visa in some cases in Florida that were transmitted locally and we’re just not some travelers. travelers from Haiti are particularly at risk for chikungunya
Jason Hartman 5:20
in terms of your your broader work you know in terms of disaster preparedness and so forth what’s going on with Fukushima? You know, I hear somewhat sporadically now you know about radiation levels in the sea and the fish and debris and so forth washing up on the west coast.
Dr. Jane Orient 5:39
How big of a concern is that and other you know, other nuclear power issues so far nobody has died from Fukushima. No one has been exposed really even gotten sick to a significant dose of radiation. Yes, there is measurable radiation in the water, but, but there’s radiation everywhere. You You can safely eat the fish. I think that a steak from one of the fish that’s been of concern, it’s kind of like eating one 20th of a banana. If you look at the actual concentration of cesium that’s in there, I think there’s just been a huge amount of hype about this. People are terrified of radiation. A lot of the stories will say, well, there’s double the back double the usual dose, but it doesn’t tell you what the dose really is. It could be 10,000 times the back background dose and still probably be insignificant. But you really need to know quantitatively what the dose is
Jason Hartman 6:33
sort of curiosity. And I don’t know if this is your area at all, but you made me curious about it when you’re talking about these different doses, microwave ovens. You know, I, I use mine fairly frequently. And should I be concerned about that?
Dr. Jane Orient 6:46
Well, I’m not I mean, it’s not ionizing radiation. Most microwave ovens, I mean, they have a shield on them. You can get a device that will measure whether any of the microwave radiation is leaking out from it. Some people say it affects The food? I don’t know of any evidence for that. So I can just say, I use it without fear. And I am not aware of any good evidence that you need to be afraid.
Jason Hartman 7:10
Is there any type of supplementation, something that someone should make sure they have in their diet to support radiation?
Dr. Jane Orient 7:17
Well, that there are stockpiles of iodine potassium iodide, that that used to be kept and maybe still are for civil defense emergencies. Because one of the isotopes from radiation accidents or from a nuclear bomb, could attack your thyroid gland and render you hypothyroid. So if you take potassium iodide ahead of time, then that will block your thyroid. So the radioactive radioactive iodine is not taken up, and it’s just excrete it. So I have some and some people do, but it’s not something that people should be panicking about.
Jason Hartman 7:57
Right, right. And that’s something you would take In an actual incident, you know, I remember I used to live in Newport Beach, California and, and people close to the San Onofre nuclear plant or given that, you know, down in San Clemente in the south part of Orange County, but you know, that’s like for emergencies. I’m just wondering if there’s a dietary thing, you know, that can offset, you know, TSA, microwave ovens, x rays at the doctor, whatever, things like that. I just thought I’d throw the question out there.
Dr. Jane Orient 8:24
I don’t know of any. But I think and I think that this, this hype about low dose radiation is is really dangerous because it gets people fearful of having diagnostic tests that they really need are medical treatments that are very beneficial. And it is also based on this linear no threshold theory that any tiny dose of radiation is harmful. And this is probably just not true. When you it’s the dose that determines the danger you can overdose on salt, water, vitamins, just about anything, but the evidence that we have Have some people in the course of their, of their occupation, say flying across country. And as on the flight crew, or working in the nuclear industry, or in the early days of the nuclear industry, when standards were much less rigorous, or accidental exposures, like in some apartments in Taiwan, that were built with contaminated rebar that infect the lowest certain dose. This radiation is probably protective, like in Taiwan, people’s cancer rate was 90% below normal below the normal expected and the surrounding areas. So I think that by just making people afraid of radiation, which by the way, is the easiest thing in the world to measure with an instrument, they are depriving themselves of some very great benefits not just nuclear energy, but medical applications.
Jason Hartman 9:53
Oh, right. Yeah, no, I I definitely agree. I mean, you know, fearmongering can definitely definitely hurt in so many ways. You’re point as well taken and duly noted there. So let’s talk about terrorism and that threat. Should the government be doing something that they’re not doing? Should we have shelters? You know what concerns are going on in that side in the civil defense side? Well,
Dr. Jane Orient 10:14
nothing. Our Civil Defense program is almost completely dismantled in the 1990s. The radiation meters that were maintained for many years for junks, I got the Arizona supply and other private private people got some of the other supplies. But the rest I think were just dumped in a landfill and they were not replaced with anything. So if there were a serious incident like somebody’s a nuclear detonation, like some of those nuclear weapons that are proliferating all over the world, we are largely unprepared to to measure what the threat is, what should we be doing about that, that we have to take matters into our own hands? I mean, should everybody own a Geiger counter? I think people should seriously look into having some instruments there are now things called cirad cards us si r ad that have a chemical compound that changes color permanently when exposed to radiation. You can get those for about $30. We have been trying to distribute things like this to first responders, firefighters and police so that they can inform people that the risk is nothing to panic about and they should go to work. Or if there is something of a risk, they should shelter in place. But people should not be going nuts. Over fear of radiation when it can be easily measured, and very often will be shown to be a level that’s not going to make them sick. There’s like little stickers, right? You can just stick them on things and they have that little radius. Yes, they did make stickers and the stickers were available at one time. I think some of those are still available, but they also have things that look like a credit card that have have a little scale on them. And a sensor that changes color. And exposure minds change color a little bit just going through airport airport x rays. frequently
Jason Hartman 12:09
in TSA, whenever you complain about that they tell you it’s not radiation. Well, what is it? I mean, you’re somehow seen through my clothes?
Dr. Jane Orient 12:16
Well, I think from those scanners, it really is insignificant that my card goes through the through on the conveyor belt. And the Yeah, there is certainly a higher dose of radiation that they use on your back,
Jason Hartman 12:31
I’d love to see a study on TSA employees who are near that equipment all day long. It’s just always on, you know, an eight hour shift five days a week, you know, someone should do a study on that if their cancer rates are higher or there are any other effects.
Dr. Jane Orient 12:46
There are a lot of studies and workers not TSA workers whose exposures very, very small, but it wants to have significant exposures like air recruits, and their cancer rates are not higher than normal because
Jason Hartman 12:57
when you’re up further in the atmosphere, it you know 40,000 feet? Is that what you’re talking about the pilots and the flight crew? Yes, you get significant doses of radiation and flight crews. So it’s it’s not that study is really it’s, it’s okay.
Dr. Jane Orient 13:09
I think so. But you know, if you if these people wanted to wear radiation monitor, they could they could buy a cirad card for themselves. I have tried to contact TSA, and told them that about this technology. I’m not worried about the equipment they’re using, but I am worried about nuclear terrorism. And these people should, should be protected on the act.
Jason Hartman 13:29
Well, you know, let’s talk about that.
Dr. Jane Orient 13:31
I mean, with all the stuff that’s going on in the world, you know, it might be a fair question to ask if we’re actually in world war three. Now, you know, it’s pretty scary what’s going on out there? I guess I’d asked that question of you and then talk about the nuclear terrorism threat. Well, I think that is a very good question. And some people say they do. We are in world war three. Like when did World War Two hop start? It didn’t start with Pearl Harbor. It was going on in Europe long before then. Are these little episodes of terrorists that we have in the United States of a part of world war three. Could we have another event much worse than 911 happening simultaneously in many cities? I think that we could. And if we did, we don’t even have the instruments. And we certainly don’t have people with educated to have the understanding school kids in the 1950s knew a whole lot more about radiation than college graduates do today.
Jason Hartman 14:26
So what what’s the main threat? Do you think? Is it a dirty bomb? Is it a Russian nuke that gets loose? I mean, Russia’s falling apart again, it seems
Dr. Jane Orient 14:36
Well, obviously a nuclear weapon is is much more dangerous than a dirty bomb. The Dirty Bomb would mainly kill people from the blast from the explosives. And it would have a huge economic effect just from the terror effects, even though the radiation dose that would be experienced would probably not kill anybody. It’s probably the blast that would kill people. But the They might shut down the whole city because of our, our, our highly over oversensitive radiation detection equipment, and just the panic that people have been, has been drilled into their heads that there’s no safe dose of radiation, anything we can do with individuals about that other than meters, which he talked about, you should inform yourself and we do have a couple of websites positions for civil defense.org and DDP online.org. That’s for doctors for disaster preparedness. And we have had an annual meeting and most of our videotapes are up on the web. Our bi monthly newsletters that I’ve been doing for about 20 years are all available and they frequently cover what the threats are, what the threats are not and what you can do, to inform and to protect yourself and your family. Very good resources, by the way. Thank you for that. So
Jason Hartman 15:58
talk to us about some of the threats, if you would we hear about global warming constantly, you know, all of these different issues of you know, I mean, there’s there’s just so much out there. What do you think some of the bigger threats are?
Dr. Jane Orient 16:10
Well, I think the big threat is the overreaction to this global warming thing. We have had this the same goal for decades, and that is to shut down and ration global energy production. And it started off with the fear that we’re going to run out of oil. And then in the 1970s, there was a fear that we’re going to have an ice age. And now there’s this global warming, which by the way, has been undetectable for the past 20 years. And we’re now at about the mean global temperature of the 3000 year average. The mean temperature of the globe has gone up and down. We’ve had ice ages we’ve had MIDI, the medieval warm period, the Roman warm period when the weather was a whole lot better than it is now. And because of this threat, which now people are attributing to emissions of carbon dioxide. They’re trying to shut down 40% of our electrical generating capacity from coal, and that will be a real disaster. So why would it be a disaster? Just to speak to that for a moment? Yeah. What do you mean economically or Well, this this, this, this country is so dependent on electricity, for safety, for food storage, for heating and cooling our homes for transportation, for hospital for law enforcement, for all of our industry. If we lost 40% of our electrical generating capacity, it would be a terrible economic catastrophe, as well as just a regular health catastrophe because people would not have the power that they need to live. No question about it. So I just find it funny that people actually think the Tesla car for example, is an environmentally friendly car. I mean, it you know, 42 I mean, some estimates say up to 60%. I guess it depends where you live and where you’re getting your power of the power is generated from coal. I mean, Tesla’s a coal burning car, largely, and then you you mine the coal, you know, you got to take it out of the ground, you got to transport it. I mean, I don’t know, you know, to me, I think nuclear is just the cleanest thing we’ve got.
Jason Hartman 18:13
So far,
Dr. Jane Orient 18:14
it is the cleanest thing we’ve bought. But But coal is it’s cheap. It’s readily available. It is essential for developing countries, if they don’t want to stay mired in poverty and misery. They’re going to have to use these available resources. But nuclear Yeah, nuclear is the safest form of large scale energy generation that exists.
Jason Hartman 18:35
So why is there so much disagreement over the whole? You know, I love how the global warming people rebranded themselves, and they call it climate change, because you can’t always prove warming. You know, why is there so much disagreement about this? I mean, I’ve had people on the show on both sides. I even had a reporter with The New Yorker on the show, who actually hung up on me because I was asking her questions. I mean, she was so convinced and so out of As you know, if you don’t believe in global warming, you’re an idiot. I mean, she literally said that. She just wouldn’t you couldn’t ask her a question. It was like, I mean, are we having a religious debate here?
Dr. Jane Orient 19:11
Yes, I really think we are. And if you are an academic, and your department gets any type of federal grants, no matter what, therefore, your whole department could be shut down by losing its grant money, if anybody there whispers any skepticism about the global warming thing. And yet, there was a petition signed by 31,000 American scientists who say there’s no scientific evidence that this is a major threat. And in fact, carbon dioxide in the atmosphere, stimulates plant growth. There’s absolutely no doubt about that. And there are many people in the world we’re eating a whole lot better, because we have a little more co2 in our atmosphere. Yeah. And interestingly, I mean, the ultimate end game of that movement has to be to reduce the population, because that’s what people exhale and people are the evil right. I think that a lot of them will explicitly say that we’ve got to reduce the population of the globe who gets to decide who stays and goes, I wonder?
Jason Hartman 20:08
Well, it’s going to not going to be you and me, that’s for sure. Very interesting. Very interesting. Very, very disconcerting, actually.
Dr. Jane Orient 20:16
Okay, well, is there anything else, Jane that I didn’t ask you that you want to throw out there and make people aware of so I think we’re living in a very dangerous time. And I think a lot of the things that people are, are fearful of, and on account of which our economy is being crippled by draconian regulations are not things to be worried about. But there are many threats that we don’t need to worry about, for example, war, and the proliferation of nuclear weapons and widespread terrorism, and our total lack of preparedness. Again, any action steps you want to leave people with he gave out the websites. It’s great resource. Thank you for that. Any other action steps and inform yourself and Try to try to try to be able to stay in your house for a couple of weeks without going out whether it’s epidemic or civil unrest or, or the truck stop coming down the road with their food supplies. everybody ought to be prepared to be self sufficient for a period of time. There are people who don’t even have any food in the house to eat for dinner.
Jason Hartman 21:21
Yeah, right, right, much less either three days, the sort of well known bug out very of the 72 hours or much less three weeks, which, you know, very important, very important thing. And it’s so inexpensive, and so easy to take some basic steps to be prepared. It’s just, it’s just responsible. So
Dr. Jane Orient 21:39
if you have enough for yourself, think about your neighbors. Would you like to be able to help your family and your neighbors? Absolutely. Very good point. Well, Dr. Jane orient, thank you so much for joining us today. My pleasure. Thank you.
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